Hannah Wettig: FGM makes all society ill
by Milena Rampoldi, ProMosaik, edited by William Hanna. An informative
interview with Hannah Wettig, Project Manager at the association Stop FGMMiddle East. I would like to thank her for her time and her detailed answers to
my questions. It is important to point out that FGM is a severe violation of
children’s and women’s
rights and that FGM concerns us all as society all over the world. We have to
expose how FGM is justified and even identified with religion. However, FGM
remains a brutal tradition destroying women’s lives.
We have to remove the taboo and start talking about it because we all need an
FGM-free world.
interview with Hannah Wettig, Project Manager at the association Stop FGMMiddle East. I would like to thank her for her time and her detailed answers to
my questions. It is important to point out that FGM is a severe violation of
children’s and women’s
rights and that FGM concerns us all as society all over the world. We have to
expose how FGM is justified and even identified with religion. However, FGM
remains a brutal tradition destroying women’s lives.
We have to remove the taboo and start talking about it because we all need an
FGM-free world.
Milena
Rampoldi: Why is it so important to struggle against FGM in all regions where
this brutal tradition is still practised?
Rampoldi: Why is it so important to struggle against FGM in all regions where
this brutal tradition is still practised?
Hannah
Wettig: First all, there is no region in which the practice has been completely
abolished. However, according to the last UNICEF statistics in many African
countries there is a strong decrease in the age group 0-14. But these figures
are not really reliable. A problem of the data collection is that in the
meantime in the majority of these countries FGM has been liable to persecution.
The parents are interviewed for these surveys. A further complication is that
the government executes these large-scale stories. So you have to count on the
fact that actions liable to persecution are not admitted.
Wettig: First all, there is no region in which the practice has been completely
abolished. However, according to the last UNICEF statistics in many African
countries there is a strong decrease in the age group 0-14. But these figures
are not really reliable. A problem of the data collection is that in the
meantime in the majority of these countries FGM has been liable to persecution.
The parents are interviewed for these surveys. A further complication is that
the government executes these large-scale stories. So you have to count on the
fact that actions liable to persecution are not admitted.
The abolition is not only essential
because FGM is a brutal abuse of children and a severe violation of human
rights, but also because of its consequences on the society as a whole. On one
hand, FGM is connected with severe health risks. In Africa where type III (the
complete amputation of the visible clitoris and the external labia) is
practised, the operation often causes the child’ death.
Mothers suffer extensively during parturition. Some mothers also die during
parturition because of FGM.
Also
in the region where we work (in Iraq and Iran) the “lighter” type II has severe consequences like incontinence,
frequent infections, and sexuality limitation.
because FGM is a brutal abuse of children and a severe violation of human
rights, but also because of its consequences on the society as a whole. On one
hand, FGM is connected with severe health risks. In Africa where type III (the
complete amputation of the visible clitoris and the external labia) is
practised, the operation often causes the child’ death.
Mothers suffer extensively during parturition. Some mothers also die during
parturition because of FGM.
Also
in the region where we work (in Iraq and Iran) the “lighter” type II has severe consequences like incontinence,
frequent infections, and sexuality limitation.
Where sexual relations are not
satisfying, aggressions and neurosis arise. Wilhelm Reich taught us that
without having FGM in mind. One of our partners, Osman Mahmoudi, has analysed
this aspect for Iran: he has not just asked women, but also their husbands
about their sexual and psychological wellbeing. And he was able to prove that
husbands with wives who have been victims of FGM not only had an essentially
worse sexual life and suffer from different deficiencies like impotence, but
that they also suffer psychologically, for example because they have more
depressions than husbands with wives who have not been circumcised. Of course,
this applies also to women, what about that other research studies were
conducted in the past. Osman Mahmoudi shows for the first time that FGM makes
women and men ill.
satisfying, aggressions and neurosis arise. Wilhelm Reich taught us that
without having FGM in mind. One of our partners, Osman Mahmoudi, has analysed
this aspect for Iran: he has not just asked women, but also their husbands
about their sexual and psychological wellbeing. And he was able to prove that
husbands with wives who have been victims of FGM not only had an essentially
worse sexual life and suffer from different deficiencies like impotence, but
that they also suffer psychologically, for example because they have more
depressions than husbands with wives who have not been circumcised. Of course,
this applies also to women, what about that other research studies were
conducted in the past. Osman Mahmoudi shows for the first time that FGM makes
women and men ill.
MR:
How important are information campaigns about FGM in Europe and why?
How important are information campaigns about FGM in Europe and why?
HW:
On one hand, the women migrants coming from countries where FGM is practised
are citizens of our society, and we have a responsibility to protect them and
especially their children. However, we have to consequently deal with the
problem in Europe because by now there are setbacks by re-emigration from
Europe or immigration by marriage. Precisely: in Iraq-Kurdistan we were able to
strongly reduce the practice. It is rare that somebody openly supports the
practice. Young men and their mothers do not request anymore from a bride to be
subject to FGM. However, Iraqi-Kurd men living in Europe look for a wife in
their country of origin who has to be circumcised. So the mothers of these
girls say: “Ok,
my daughter can marry, but she can marry better if she is circumcised.”
On one hand, the women migrants coming from countries where FGM is practised
are citizens of our society, and we have a responsibility to protect them and
especially their children. However, we have to consequently deal with the
problem in Europe because by now there are setbacks by re-emigration from
Europe or immigration by marriage. Precisely: in Iraq-Kurdistan we were able to
strongly reduce the practice. It is rare that somebody openly supports the
practice. Young men and their mothers do not request anymore from a bride to be
subject to FGM. However, Iraqi-Kurd men living in Europe look for a wife in
their country of origin who has to be circumcised. So the mothers of these
girls say: “Ok,
my daughter can marry, but she can marry better if she is circumcised.”
I heard similar stories from an
organisation working in Africa. A colleague even told me about a village where
relatives living in Great Britain wanted to build a school only under the
condition that girls have to be circumcised again.
organisation working in Africa. A colleague even told me about a village where
relatives living in Great Britain wanted to build a school only under the
condition that girls have to be circumcised again.
MR:
What does FGM mean to you personally as woman and as human rights activist?
What does FGM mean to you personally as woman and as human rights activist?
HW:
I have been dealing with the Middle East Region for 20 years now and have lived
there for many years. Therefore, I am particularly keen on changing the
conditions there and on supporting people who try to change their miserable
living conditions characterised by continuous crisis and wars. I do not refer
to the economic conditions, but to the oppression, narrowness and total control
of the individual. Women suffer from a threefold, fourfold, and fivefold
oppression – and
FGM is a decisive part of it. Even if FGM is not the only point, FGM is a
matter through which you can deal with many problems in society: sexuality,
love, respect in the family, and the right to their own body.
I have been dealing with the Middle East Region for 20 years now and have lived
there for many years. Therefore, I am particularly keen on changing the
conditions there and on supporting people who try to change their miserable
living conditions characterised by continuous crisis and wars. I do not refer
to the economic conditions, but to the oppression, narrowness and total control
of the individual. Women suffer from a threefold, fourfold, and fivefold
oppression – and
FGM is a decisive part of it. Even if FGM is not the only point, FGM is a
matter through which you can deal with many problems in society: sexuality,
love, respect in the family, and the right to their own body.
MR:
Which are the main objectives of Stop FGM Mideast?
Which are the main objectives of Stop FGM Mideast?
HW:
The long-term objective is the abolition of FGM in Asia.
The long-term objective is the abolition of FGM in Asia.
However,
when we started our campaign, we had to disclose the fact that FGM also exists
without Africa. At that time, almost nobody knew about it or the information
was ignored. At the beginning, we collected all we could find and made in
accessible to the public and put it on our website archive. We talked to
journalists and had a regular exchange with UNICEF.
when we started our campaign, we had to disclose the fact that FGM also exists
without Africa. At that time, almost nobody knew about it or the information
was ignored. At the beginning, we collected all we could find and made in
accessible to the public and put it on our website archive. We talked to
journalists and had a regular exchange with UNICEF.
Often we just found single contributions
from bloggers describing FGM in their country. In Oman, we found three people
who had written about FGM. Nevertheless, there were no research studies.
Therefore, we travelled to Oman and spoke to people. Then we told UNICEF about
our findings: as if it were the most self-evident thing in the world, women
told us that they are all circumcised. Even the “circumciser” told us what she does. Now UNICEF put
Oman on the list of countries where FGM is practised and will carry out a
research in the country.
from bloggers describing FGM in their country. In Oman, we found three people
who had written about FGM. Nevertheless, there were no research studies.
Therefore, we travelled to Oman and spoke to people. Then we told UNICEF about
our findings: as if it were the most self-evident thing in the world, women
told us that they are all circumcised. Even the “circumciser” told us what she does. Now UNICEF put
Oman on the list of countries where FGM is practised and will carry out a
research in the country.
We have collected information about
other Gulf countries, from Iran to Pakistan – and then we noticed that we had chosen a wrong name
for our association. We should have called ourselves Stop FGM Asia, since we
also found information about FGM in India, Sri Lanka, on the Maldives, in
Malaysia, Brunei, Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia, on the Philippines – and only a couple of months ago also in
Cambodia and the Russian Republic of Dagestan. In this respect, the research
for new information is still going on.
other Gulf countries, from Iran to Pakistan – and then we noticed that we had chosen a wrong name
for our association. We should have called ourselves Stop FGM Asia, since we
also found information about FGM in India, Sri Lanka, on the Maldives, in
Malaysia, Brunei, Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia, on the Philippines – and only a couple of months ago also in
Cambodia and the Russian Republic of Dagestan. In this respect, the research
for new information is still going on.
However, by now we have achieved that in
all involved circles FGM is not considered as a pure African problem anymore.
We have organised regional meetings with many activists and today these
activists will also be invited to international conferences about FGM. This is
the first big step.
all involved circles FGM is not considered as a pure African problem anymore.
We have organised regional meetings with many activists and today these
activists will also be invited to international conferences about FGM. This is
the first big step.
Further steps depend on the
ideas and activities of our partners. We are convinced that to be effective
change must happen locally. We cooperate with many great women and men in Oman,
Iraq, Iran, Singapore, Malaysia, India and Indonesia, who have very good
project ideas to oppose FGM. In most cases, only money is needed.
ideas and activities of our partners. We are convinced that to be effective
change must happen locally. We cooperate with many great women and men in Oman,
Iraq, Iran, Singapore, Malaysia, India and Indonesia, who have very good
project ideas to oppose FGM. In most cases, only money is needed.
MR:
Which are the main obstacles on the spot to end FGM?
Which are the main obstacles on the spot to end FGM?
HW:
First of all, you have to break the taboo. Usually, at the beginning
politicians and even official women organisations simply deny the existence of
the phenomenon. Therefore, you need evidence. We have developed a guideline for
simple surveys so that the activists can carry out small surveys on the spot
and deliver this evidence.
First of all, you have to break the taboo. Usually, at the beginning
politicians and even official women organisations simply deny the existence of
the phenomenon. Therefore, you need evidence. We have developed a guideline for
simple surveys so that the activists can carry out small surveys on the spot
and deliver this evidence.
In all Asian countries, religious
authorities also constitute a decisive
factor. Except in Cambodia, FGM in Asia – more than in Africa – is considered as an Islamic practice or
even as religious duty. Where scholars support this point of view, there will
be no chance to abolish FGM. Nevertheless, almost everywhere there are some
clerics saying that FGM is not Islamic. The religious sources (not the Quran
which does NOT mention female circumcision) of the Hadith are not unambiguous.
Nevertheless, from an Islamic point of view there are very good reasons to
prohibit FGM.
authorities also constitute a decisive
factor. Except in Cambodia, FGM in Asia – more than in Africa – is considered as an Islamic practice or
even as religious duty. Where scholars support this point of view, there will
be no chance to abolish FGM. Nevertheless, almost everywhere there are some
clerics saying that FGM is not Islamic. The religious sources (not the Quran
which does NOT mention female circumcision) of the Hadith are not unambiguous.
Nevertheless, from an Islamic point of view there are very good reasons to
prohibit FGM.
In the following campaigns, clerics
should have no role to play –
and
should not do so because it is a matter of human rights, and not of religion.
However, in the beginning it is essential to cooperate with them to overcome
the obstacle.
should have no role to play –
and
should not do so because it is a matter of human rights, and not of religion.
However, in the beginning it is essential to cooperate with them to overcome
the obstacle.
MR:
Which are the positive signs on the spot showing that finally something will
change?
Which are the positive signs on the spot showing that finally something will
change?
HW:
According to the most recent UNICEF survey in Northern Iraq 80% of the
respondents refuse FGM. As we started our campaign in 2006, 78% of the girls of
the regions where FGM was practised were circumcised. In the region of
Dohuk, where FGM was not practised, there also was no “refusal”, but lack of
knowledge about the existence of FGM in any place in Kurdistan. We reach the
whole population with our TV spots, and in many villages where we started 10
years ago, FGM has disappeared. Since that the prohibition has been entered
into force, in addition we can get in touch with the scholars who have
propagated FGM until now.
According to the most recent UNICEF survey in Northern Iraq 80% of the
respondents refuse FGM. As we started our campaign in 2006, 78% of the girls of
the regions where FGM was practised were circumcised. In the region of
Dohuk, where FGM was not practised, there also was no “refusal”, but lack of
knowledge about the existence of FGM in any place in Kurdistan. We reach the
whole population with our TV spots, and in many villages where we started 10
years ago, FGM has disappeared. Since that the prohibition has been entered
into force, in addition we can get in touch with the scholars who have
propagated FGM until now.
